Thursday, January 1, 2015

Found on Roosh’s forum: Guy does 3000 approaches in 10 years, has zero success, and wonders why “game” doesn’t work

I was recently made aware of a rather intriguing post on Roosh’s forum that perfectly illustrates everything that’s wrong with “gamers”: Why Hasn't Game Worked? 

In short, some dude writes down his life story in a few thousands words, and the gist of it is that despite swallowing the “red pill”, and diligently approaching women with his amazing game, he never got laid. You can probably sense were this is going: he’s obviously wondering why his “technique” doesn’t work.

That guy is a poster boy of the frustrated manosphere. Instead of fantasising about banging foreign chicks, like so many of them do, he actually temporarily moved to a third-world country. There, he found out that he needed money to get laid as well. In fact, he mentions that he had sex there times: twice with hookers, and one time with a girl he met online. Apparently, there was some monetary exchange involved as well, since he writes, “But it didn't feel right. I wasn't sure how to tell if it was real, or if they were only trying to scam me or gold-dig.”

He summarises his situation as follows:
I approached like a machine. I did over 1000 approaches in the span of a year, in college, in the prime of my youth, when I had all my hair, a decent wardrobe, and a universally recognized "bright future" ahead of me. Now I'm bald (probably from all the stress and lack of physical touch from women), and have no societal "place". I've done a grand total of 3000 approaches (maybe more) throughout my career, and the only thing I've gotten from it is 3000 pieces of evidence that no matter how hard I work, and how many risks I take, I'm still not going to succeed. I almost wish I had never approached, and never learned game, because at least that way I'd still have hope that I could succeed if only I were to try. 
3000 approaches and not a single girlfriend. Not a single lay. Barely even a kiss. It's like I'm just INVISIBLE. What the fuck is going on? Please, somebody, help me.
There is one key element that isn't quite specified. He mentions that he's short, but doesn't quantify it for quite a while.

The Roosh forum crowd at first calls him a troll. As I remarked in my last article, people with very little success tend to build an ego around the little success they have. This leads them to inflate their own success, and to become hostile towards everybody who questions the religion of “game”.

Eventually, advice comes:
See a girl, talk to a girl, touch a girl.
Works everywhere in the world, regardless of language or culture.
This is how babies get made!
Somewhere between Talk and Touch, you haven't provided ANY information about
- what you're saying and doing
- how she's reacting
You already know your own problem
"But I was afraid to escalate"
What’s missing? Well, the entire preparation. No girl will let you touch her if you don’t look good enough for her, whatever her personal standard may be. Besides, we're still left in the dark with regards to some basic factors.

Some advice wasn’t entirely misguided, though:

The best advice I can give you is to start making money. I used to put in countless hours approaching and never got laid, but when I started making money things changed. honestly it's a better use of your time to make money instead of approaching. Making money is the best way to get laid. Fact.
Otherwise, it’s the usual. He gets told he has to work on his personality, study comedy, “see the value” in himself, learn to “frame” things the right way and all that other nonsense. Some guy who seemingly hasn’t gotten laid in a decade either advises him to befriend girls:
4. Give them your number for SOCIAL REASONS, in this case yoga n smoothie/food with friends. (Have them text you their name)
5a. Do this with 10-15 chicks
This of course leads to the problem that it’s next to impossible to move out of the friend zone, because girls who want to have sex with you are not going to be friends with you first to begin with, but instead are eager to spread her legs. If you are indecisive, they will simply lose interest.

Roosh himself chimed in:

For a small percentage of men, no amount of "game" or approaches can work, but then again we have no idea what type of game you're using. You would have to hire an expert to diagnose the problem.

Fantastic advice! Or not. The problem, though, is that “game” is useless if your foundations aren’t in order. If they are, then “game” is irrelevant but, and that’s the kicker, “game” is also irrelevant if your foundations need to be improved.

Some other guy had something more helpful to say:

OP- your experience is not unique! I've known several guys with a similar story. I don't think you are a troll or a female.
While reading your story I already knew what the problem is - you don't escalate! 

Again, this ignored the elephant in the room: how does that dude look like, and how tall or short is he?

Eventually he reveals that he is only 5’2”. He's also balding, so that’s two big disadvantages right there. On the plus side, someone on that forum claims that he had skyped with that dude, and that he was above-average looking. Later on, he posted pictures of himself. He’s not bad looking, but could lose a bit of weight. It seems that it’s primarily his height that’s holding him back.

I’d say his best chance would be to get inlays for his shoes, fix his outfit, shave his head, and look for women who are at most as tall as himself. This wouldn’t leave him with a lot of options, but it would still be better than approaching 3,000 women at random.

However, he followed the “red pill” path, and moved to China. That part of the forum discussion is amusing to read as well. Some claim it was easy to get laid there as a Westerner, but others paid attention in school and remembered that China has a one-child policy and that girls are often aborted, which should lead to a rather poor male/female ratio.

But, don’t despair:
China has a terrible m/f ratio, but only if you are a poor Chinese guy with no Game. 
It seems it’s impossible to argue with those who believe in the religion of “game”.

He does fare better in China, though, at least on the "red herrings" metric:

American girls are the rudest, meanest rejectors. Chinese girls continue to be kind, and treat me well - but I can tell they have zero interest in anything romantic or physical. As far as dating goes, I'm no more on their radar than I am on an American girl's radar. 
Fuck this. This ain't what I signed up for. 
I am gathering up the courage to tell my very nice and kind coworkers and boss that I'm leaving. Everything here was perfect, except for not having feminine affection.
Well, it's certainly not as if they did tell him that blow jobs or a "girlfriend experience" was part of his compensation, so his sense of entitlement strikes me as misplaced. At that point in the thread I did have the impression that his "inner game" could need some work, i.e. a psychologist might be what he needs more than getting his dick wet. Look at this:

Fuck the whole world.  
The only point in living is to love and be loved. If you don't have that, you might as well take the beautiful gift of life and return it to the store. It's worthless. 
My main - no, ONLY - purpose in life now is to find someone to love. There is nothing else. All of my hobbies and interests are worthless. I don't give a shit about any of it. Everything I used to care about, everything I used to be passionate about, is dead to me. 
Sadly this is a trap many men and women fall into. No, your romantic partners are not there to give your life meaning. If you're a miserable piece of shit without having someone to fuck, you're most likely remain a miserable piece of shit even if you manage to get a girlfriend.

That thread thus took a rather bad turn. At the end, a user named Melodramati tries to speak some sense, and gets banned quickly:

I am not saying that there is NO such thing as game. I am saying that game can't really compensate for looks, status or money and game might be something different than what the typical PUA says it is.

The response he got was straight from the unwritten textbook of manosphere idiocy:

No - what you say is exactly what Game-denialism is. 

Response from SaneGuy:

Of course you can still get laid if you're ugly. It'll just be harder, the women will be of lower qualities and the women who are into you will be fewer. You are talking about "game" like it some sacred magical force or science. Game is neither, game is VERY simply put; not fucking up when girls are already attracted to you and being good at escalation. I am not a "PUAhater" and even if I was, why would the idea that it is "mainstream" make any difference? 
You are speaking in very hypothetical situations and your arguments are not grounded in reality but in presumptions. Furthermore, does any of these oh so great PUAs of yours actually have any proof of all the "HB9's" that they pull? No. Its easy to exaggerate. You blind trust in authorities and discourse is sickening.
At this point the thread comes full circle. That sane poster got banned. Ironically, the very same beliefs he pointed out where what got the thread starter into this whole mess of approaching women randomly for 10 years, without taking his shortcomings into account.


  1. I feel the strong urge to comment and yet I really don't know what to say about this very strange case.

    I'm more or less speechless. I'm literally shocked! Yes, FUCKING SHOCKED!!!

    Reading this feels like beeing thrown into a Kafkaesqe nightmare or into the twilight zone 0_o

    So fucking bizzare!!!

    This poor bastard can thank

    1) PUAtards

    2) RooshosphereTards

    3) Feminists

    4) Mainstream dating advice

    and last but not least

    5) his own lack of critical thinking

    for the mess he finds himself in today.

    If 3 and 4 were not so full of shit, he might have never fallen prey to 1 and 2.

    I feel so fucking sorry for this man! A lost poor soul burning in his very own hell fire!!!

    May he find salvation soon! (No sarcasm. I really mean it.)

    "That sane poster got banned." All quiet on the western front :D

    At least he was not threatened and Roosh did not start a campaing to haress him in real life. At least not yet ;)


    1. I guess the guy's issues could have stopped at everyone beating around the bush about him being short, socially awkward and bald, but I doubt he even brings a worthwhile income to the table as well. Look, I'm not going to pretend I get laid by the minute, but even I know that women don't want to have anything to do with some guy who has startling codependency issues. They want a guy who gets things done in life, not a pile of feelings. I get a serious dose of love when I get to reply to women that I've been taking the last year off to mow down my masters degree.

      THAT is game. Something you can toot your horn over. Not some aspie scripted crap that women have heard endlessly over the last umpteen years.

  2. I worked with a Chinese women who was almost 6 feet tall. She said she never got asked on a date when she lived in China because Chinese men will not date a women taller than they are. It wasn't until she came to the U.S. for college that she dated anyone.

  3. hi aaron , this is unrelated but after reading your blog for the last 10-15 posts, and reading
    alek i can more easily recognize potential in the street( fuck me eyes)

    however i cant make the first move at all, my mind just go blank, fuck, heck i dont
    know what to do. its like when you your computer gets stuck and shit, i follow the same
    path, umm after the fact i hate it because i miss so many nice chances, even if
    i dont dress well i see some girl might be attracted. i think it goes back to my history as
    i have grown, if this continues as it goes now, i am fucked. to say the least.

  4. Poor guy.

    Even though I wouldn't like to encourage people to post their private pictures online for the whole world to see, in this case it was quite helpful that he did so. In my humble opinion he's actually not a bad looking guy! OK, he's most certainly NOT the kind of pussyslayer he'd like to be – but he definitely has a winning, likeable smile! Most certainly he WOULD find women who like his type and whom he'd also find attractive, if he just were to present & position himself intelligently and efficiently.

    Of course he could improve his outward appearance by getting a overall distinctive, advantageous STYLE, work out to get toned, thus exude basic masculine vitality and dress in a way that accentuates his more slender figure. And yes, he also might want to shave his head. In pic #4 I noticed a stark scar on the right side of his skull, which could look REALLY cool and a bit bad-boy-like (e. g. just like the scar on Harrison Ford's chin ;), if he were to feature it the right way in the context of an advantageous style, so chicks might dig it. He should really work with what's already there and, as Sleazy rightly pointed out, he could make definite progress .

    Of course in those photos he posted he doesn't exude ANY SEXUALITY and independence/positive sexual aggressiveness, yada yada. But this should be about to change along with the noticeable changes of his outward appearance. Maybe stop hanging around solely with broadfaced Asian Buddhist (?) chicks (photo #4) and read up on some tasty Friedrich Nietzsche for a change. *LOL*

    Great post as always, Sleazy!

  5. Just let me drop a not exactly classy but truthful joke here:

    This guy walks into a bar. Sits next to another guy. Some good conversation and a couple drinks later the guy says: "I could fuck any girl in here".

    The other guy says: "Thats pretty ambitious, what makes you think that?""

    The guy says: "Because I'm a rapist."

  6. It always baffles me how people can be so gullible with pickup. Most of the instructors look like they'd be lucky to pull a drunk bar pig, but yet some guys still worship them.

    I can't for the life of me picture Roosh,Krauser or Tom Torero getting top shelf women.

    I think if you're going to try and market "game", you should at least look the part before you try scamming people.

    I can't help but laugh when I see blogger Matt Forney trying to promote some protein supplement he apparently uses.

    My thoughts are always, "Dude, you look like you just devoured a lemon meringue pie"

    1. There is a reason roosh almost always talks about feminism/manosphere shit. Anger gets more clicks than truth.

      Is there even a good definition of game? It seems that for everybody it just means 'whatever I do to get girls'

      Or it is a 70 step program with all kinds of rationalizations. (Now available for 30 bucks!).

    2. Lol, exactly. "Whatever I do to get girls" is plenty.

      I was actually told by a PUA through email this summer that using Tinder was not "game".

      I totally disagreed. The reason I'm getting the matches is because I take care of myself. You still have to get the girl on a date and then take it from there. Who cares if I didn't tough it out on the street for 8 hours to get that woman?

      On a side note, is Roosh's site comedy or for real?

      Just read this

      Something tells me he's going to put out an article soon with all the steps needed to brush your teeth.

      He seems very angry towards women in general. He really bashes women in Canada and the US. I am a Canadian myself and although I have never been outside of North America, I would assume being in shape, having good style/grooming, have goals/passions and having a good personality would work in other parts of the world? I have no idea? Seems to work fine in Canada and the US ;)

      Roosh is likely just leaning in too much when he's getting rejected :P

    3. Roosh bangs hookers in foreign countries and doesn't pay them. It can be seen in his stories when some women ask for money before or after sex (they usually phrase it as needing it for a cab, medicine, or something, possibly to dodge prostitution laws).

      Roosh and Swoop the World (another Rooshite apparently) are perfectly okay with fucking hookers as long as they don't pay for it (otherwise it wouldn't count as a "notch"). So, these guys aren't necessarily fucking a normal woman in these countries.

    4. Lmfao! I hadn't looked into Roosh much until I came across this blog.

      What really confuses me though is this? WHY THE FUCK does he have so many followers? Sounds like he's being honest though, unlike most PUA's. He more or less claims to suck with women and he has almost 20,000 likes on facebook?

      Pretty soon Roosh will be saying, "Met this unreal HB blond9 last night on the dance floor. If I play my cards right, I may get to second base. Maybe I'll even get a "full close" for under 100$"

      Want some laughter guys? Check this out lol

      Like most guys who ACTUALLY get laid know, positions, angles, memorizing stories/lines, even leaving your hands in your pocket is very irrelevant if the girls finds you attractive. You can borderline tell fart jokes (maybe a bit of a stretch) if she's into you ,and you almost need to give off the vibe you're a serial killer to have her lose interest.

    5. I've seen it posted that Roosh buys most of his followers. I'm not "in" on how that is determined, but it makes sense considering how few likes most of his FB posts have.

    6. Something tells me he's going to put out an article soon with all the steps needed to brush your teeth.

      Be careful. I've seen excerpts of articles where he tends towards the unkempt/unhygienic side, to put it mildly. This is an article that he may indeed put out there as a newsflash.

  7. I've seen way too many short girls with height fetishes in the USA at least. I mean talking with 5'0-5'4" girls that insist on the guy being over 6'. I'm speaking as a 6'4" lucky bastard here.

    1. That height issue is a sticky one, since I'm 5'11" myself. You know how I avoid that? I don't do OLD and turn myself into a pile of potentially unsuitable numbers to get DQed on a whim. I'm 35 and probably shouldn't go there (then again, most 35-year old women are trash), but if I do a 18-27 year old women search in my locale on POF, almost no women can match what I bring to the table (good credit, income, a couple of vehicles, etc) and I'm fine with that. There is a reason those examples of losers are on the internet looking for Mr Right when most of them answer phones or work customer service jobs for a living. I'm not up for being disqualified by a woman who is unlikable in person who has to pick through garbage online that wouldn't dare approach/DQ me in public.

  8. Roosh was also very bitter about not getting laid in Sweden and Denmark, blaming feminism and westernisation.

    He completely ignored the fact that 75% of Scandinavian guys have better looks and style than him. He had no real advantage on being well travelled, having a better education or more money either, even if he targeted second tier cities.

    1. Can someone enlighten me on this? He claims Canada and the US to be so hard to pickup? I don't find that to be the case at all. As Aaron said, no such thing as a "pussy paradise". If you take of yourself, I'm quite sure that would be more than enough anywhere in the world.

      In fact, one PUA once said (can't remember who) Montreal does not have attractive women. BULLSHIT! It's been said time and time again that Montreal has some of the most beautiful women in the world. Anyone who has ever been there before can attest to how many smokeshows there is. They also tend to be quite friendly.

      Btw, who needs an ab workout when you can watch Vince Kelvin "game" fatties lol. I almost fell off my chair I was laughing so hard lol. Man this guy is a hoot.

    2. Wait, till you saw the video, where V. K. not only "gamed", but literally banged a massively obese female member of the human species! (Your days won't be the same afterwards *LOL*)

    3. Things are different from one place to another(both in and out of country).
      One reason I think some guys think a foreign country is key to success, is because they haven't moved much in their own locale.
      Having lived all over America(and nowhere else), I can say that different looks and different personality types are indeed more popular based on region, and even sections of town. So if you go to ten different cities, odds are, you will legitimately do better in one of them.
      But that's based on you, more than the city itself. So if you strike out in Montreal but do better in Dallas, it may be true that Dallas is better - for you. But in general? Probably not much, if at all. The reverse is just as likely to be true.

    4. I totally agree that things can differ from place to place. In fact, Montreal is not a hard place to meet women, nor is Florida. I've been to Dallas before, but not in a long time. I guess what I was trying to say, women will ALWAYS(this isn't some type of fad) be attracted to men that look good, have financial means and status. But yeah, you're right, some places will vary slightly. Again, I've never been outside of Canada or the US. I haven't noticed much of a difference from the places I've been though. Then again, not a huge difference between Canada and the US though.

  9. This reminds me of a post I saw recently that has to be seen to be believed:

    A few comments down, a guy says that if you approach 1000 women, get a date with 60, and bang 27, that's a 45% success rate! Because, for some reason, the number of chicks you approach doesnt count, somehow!

    And if you think going to another country is like finding Shangri La, think again. A neighbor of mine is dating a Chinese immigrant, and it's obvious from what he says about her that Western ideas have penetrated pretty far into China's society and culture. If you want a place where women are nothing like Americans, you probably have to go to North Korea.

    1. I really cannot understand that typical male fantasy of wanting to bang as many women as humanly possible.
      It's a fata morgana fueled by men, who don't have something better to do with their life.

      In reality - even with an efficient process for it - hitting on chix is conscious effort and as such requires a substantial investment of time, energy and other resources. Nobody, who has something real going on in his life, can sustain such a drain on his most important resources over a prolonged stretch of time. Even if he does gain great personal development along with fucking new pussies.

      This would only really be worthwile to realize, if you could have a different Playboy playmate (or sth. comparable) on your sheets at your service every other day and without much effort.

      If you have no groupies stalking you 24/7, or aren't in a natural position to encounter a steady influx of desireable, potentially available women, you have to resort to escorts or higher level prostitution. Here, banging a fresh, new highly desireable and sexually available girl day-in, day-out (or multiple ones in one instance) is a piece of cake. If you take Berlin price for sexual quality you might have to calculate € 300 for a goid 2 hrs. of frollicking. An entire week would thus cost you roundabout € 2100.- This might seem like a lot of dough, but it's much cheaper than reluctantly paying child support to a bitchy ex-wife. And we're talking about actually fucking willing, drop-dead gorgeous "class A" girls without any bullshit effort and more or less guaranteed sexual satisfaction.

      Compare this with the "pussy-slayer paradise" fantasy, which is idiotic, not the least, because only a minority of women could be considered biologically attractive at all and most women (just like most men) are not particularly great lovers. So there'd be no intrinsic motivation at all to polish the cunts of black female holes of boredom.

      Of course, if you own a strip club or happen to be Ghengis Khan, my facetious musings don't really apply...

    2. Can you elaborate on how to find those high-class "escorts"? Do you look for girls on those typical escort service sites?

    3. Funny story about escorts: I was visiting an escort just recently: big failure!
      Fasten your seatbelts and get your popcorn, buddies:
      She was certanly my type of girl and I liked her profile on this hooker page, but I had a bad feeling from the very beginning.

      When I was talking to her on the phone to set up a "date" she was answering very briefly and in an indiffrent way, getting even a bit angry, when I asked her to tell me how to best get there. She had some kind of "getthoish" slang, which should have been another red flag for me.

      But since she really was my type body-wise I choose to not trust my intuition and still went down to the most run down part of the city to bang her.

      The motel room smelled like a window had not been opened in ages. The smell of cheap body lotions and even canabis hit my nose like a sleadge hammer. The room looks like a garbage dump. The bathroom looks like a mess.

      There is no hanger for my coat, she does not offer me something to drink or ask me how I am doing and if I had problems finding the motel.
      She asks me in a quite rude way to wash my dick, because I took a piss (I can of course understand this question, but the way she asked was not freindly at all.)

      Beeing a horney moron I still hand her over the fee for one hour and go to the shower.
      I return, she sits on the bed -now naked- and I'm blown away, what a hottie!!!!
      She sucks my dick somewhat hard, then puts over the rubber and asks me what position I like. She sits on top of me and we fuck. But it feels so lame! She looks good, but she does not feel good.
      Her breasts feel flabby at the upper half and like stone below. WTF?

      Her skin is rough and dry and although her ass looks nice I'm bored, when I touch it.

      After a while she askes me if I want to change position. And that was my sexual Stalingrad, if you like, i.e. th begining of the end =P

      Stay tuned for part 2

    4. Part two of hooker desaster:

      We than change into missionary and my dick softens due to her unfriendly attitude, the dirty room, the funny smells in this room and last not least that this is only my third time of havig sex with a woman (feels so diffent than jacking) so that I can't enter. She gets somewhat angry. I tell her "It's okay, just let's start again with blowing, if it get's flabby again during fucking just finish me off by hand." I ask her if I should shower my dick again, she says (angry again): "Of course!!!"

      I do so, she now somewhat harshly pushes my legs apart (the first time she blew me, I kind of rested my legs on her ass). Then she jerks me. She uses an insane amount of lubricant. She roughly graps my balls, I yell in pain: She askes me, weather I don't like my balls touched. I say, I don't like them squeezed. She utters a half assed appology.

      I ask her where to shoot my load. She says: "on your belly, what do you think?" I ask: "Your Breasts?" "Yeah, fine with me."

      Make a long story short: Half an hour in and I still can't come. She yells at me. Saying it makes no sence, as long as I'm mentally blocked. She says: "Why do you guys*(sic!) visit a hooker, if you're that blocked."

      (*Apparently I wasen't the first man at all she failed to please!)

      I aboard and tell her I'm going to the shower again to wash my dick before I dress. She quite friendly (WTF??) says:" yes, of course.No problem."

      I ask her to give me some kind of sales discount, she refuses. I leave at that, the pimp(s) will make sure, that I recive the shorter end of the stick, I think to myself.
      As I close the bathroom door behind me, she says: "The whole room smells like sweat!"
      I return from my little shower, she is flipping with her phone and talking to her pimp or boyfriend that she has finished work and will leave the motel now, while I dress myself.

      I leave the room, she follows me to the elevator, still playing with her phone. She looks nervous and tense.

      We leave the elevator, she lets me go first I leave the motel I don't look back, I don't talk to her.

      But I do not just want to bitch; but instead end with a constructive comment.

      So please stay tuned for ...

    5. Error analysis:

      You can tell me I acted like a moron and I can't really disagree.

      I choose to overlook many red flags and proceeded nonetheless. Hornyness took over.

      I don't know what was wrong with this girl, but she had issuses.
      She was chaotic (the room was testamonial of this, she even asked my if I had a charing cable for her phone with me)
      she was not enyoing her work (and my company) and she did not have the desency and social competnce to hide this fact from me, her customer.

      She even just stopped jacking me, although I had a hard on this time and would have come within the next few minuets, but she said she could not be bothered getting herself a cramp in her arm so she just stopped, yelled at me and told me how I was mentally blocked :D

      She maybe was some borderline case and she proballby had to smoke weed before meeting up with me.

      I want go into depth abouth her motives and whatnot, but she looked unhappy, tense and she probaplly would be better off doing something else for a living.

      So what can I do now to avoid such unpleasent encounters in the future?

      1) Only go for "high class" escorts. Only girls from the same culuturall and ethnical background. And students, i.e. girls with an accademic background. Even if I have to spend more money meeting this type of chicks.

      2) Chat the escorts up on the phone and TRUST MY GUT feeling.

      3) Be honest about my "potency problems" on the phone and ask the girl if she can spend a hour with a naked man and his tiny noodle without going all ape shit

      That's it.

      At least i did not travel to a third world country for this ;)

    6. Well, what do you expect me to comment on your experience? If it happened at all the way you recounted it, you didn't have an encounter with the kind of girls I was talking about. But at the sad, low level of prostitution this can be expected.

      Besides, surprisingly the encounter "dude + escortgirl" turns out to be an encounter of a man and a woman and - believe it or not - yes, even paysex girls actually are still women. Ok, the girl is getting paid to cut you some slack, but apart from that basic rules of social interactions still do apply. I suppose you live in a Commonwealth country, so I cannot comment on your on-site circumstances in detail. I happen to live in Germany and when talking about enjoyable escort/pay6 I rather thought about girls similar to this:

    7. Thanks for replying, Marco!

      I checked out the link and the girls take 160 Euros/h. "My" girl took 150 Euros/h (but kicked me out after 30 min).

      I'm actually also from germany.

      I found her on a site where hobby prostitues (Hobbyhuren) are adverticing.
      And it was only when I arrived at her place, that I became aware that I wasen't meting her in her flat (like I did with another Hobby prostitue a few month ago), but in a motel, where gilrs like her rent themself a room for the mere pourpose to meet up with their Johns (Modelwohnungen).

      I prefer Hobby prostitutes because they are for the most part "freelancers" (no pimps) and they only do this as a second job and I don't want to take part in the "sad, low level of prostitution". But she might have been pimped.

      And I definetly can understand, that she wants her fun also and I would have loved to give it to her, but can't I expect some respect? They are called profetionals, so they should act professional.

      Is she expecting me to pay her for pleasing her?

      I even agreed when she shifted the time for our meet up to 30 min later (letting me basically wait in the cold) and she yells at me because she does not want to give me a handjob. WTF?

      (The other prostitue I saw back in summer of last year took it way cooler. She had her place cleaned up and treated me frindly all the way althugh I could not keep my hard on. We just cuddeled for the last 20 min.)

      After all I did not attemp to take a dump in her face, all I'm "guilty" of is not getting/keeping an errection. If I could have controlled it by willpower, my cock would have pulsed like never before and I would have pounded her like there's no tommorow.

      I can understand if she can't handel this situation (although as a prostitute she better should), but she could at least give me some discount. She could have left me 100 or maybe 50 Bucks.

      Maybe she was expecting a decent shagg (she coment on my body and asked me if I work out- could also only have been some flattering talk to please the customer) and got dispointed.

      Maybe her being spanish and me a german lead to cultural diffrences. (She spoke perfect german, apart from those little gettho speak ("Kanack-Sprach", "ösch" instead of "ich" etc.)

      Lord only knows.


      Thanks again for commenting!

      I know I overlooked quite a few red flags and made obvoius mistakes. You live and you learn.

      I don't want to bitch, just share my story :)

    8. Ok, lesson learned! ;)

      Well, as far as I'm concerned, if I feel like I'm in the mood for paysex for a change, I either go for brothels like the ones I mentioned or for actual escorts. And no, not all girls in those arrangements are blasé proffessionals, many do it part-time on the side (at least in a metropolis, like Berlin - I once met one of those girls from a brothel in a club partying on a Saturday night)

      One thing one must critisize about prostitution though, is that you pay the girl twice: with $$$ and with your lovemaking (if you are good & versatile in bed, as I am). You are in fact pleasuring her back AND giving her money. That's a shitty arrangement, which is only somewhat bearable for me, if the girl in question either is of such stunning overall beauty and attractiveness (i. e. the most utterly beautiful females, I've had sex with), that I just don't care or if there is a very special chemistry between us, so that she grants me favours for free, fucks me longer than I paid for or (I've had that happen once) meets up with me in private, to have sex with me for free - all of this just because she likes me. This "chemistry" aspect you can notice (like with any women) during the first seconds of an interaction, before you give her the money. I must add to that, that I treat prostitutes the exact same way as any other women, I'm sexually interested in or have sex with. I don't discriminate, because ultimately women all are women.

      But another stupid disadvantage of prostitution for sure is the inherent time limit. I don't like to stop the free flow intimacy & personal contact at a pre-set time. But that's life...

      If you are of a more adventurous nature and interested in sex with 2 or more girls at once, I'd recommend you should check out "Sex-Parties", at least in Berlin. They take place at several "private" venues for an entire day. The girls of course are all prostitutes and usually there are 4 - 6 of them present. You pay once (e. g. € 80.-), change, shower and can stay for as long as you want and fuck as many girls as often as you like.

      Now, here's the kicker for me: most guys you'll meet there will be the typical German emasculate loser hubbys - they don't get shit done, are asexual and the girls openly laugh about them or even despise them (it's sad & absurd to watch at the same time).

      Aaron once wrote in "Debunking..." about guy's, who "for whatever reason wouldn't even get laid in a brothel". Those are precisely the guys you'll meet there. For a sexual, dominant, fun-loving and raunchy guy with a ripped body they're no match. The girls will flock to you and taking a bored girl away from one of those hubbys, even while she's sucking him is a piece of cake. So you can have sex more or wall those girls present in all imaginable ways, you're the boss in the henhouse, they'll definitely have fun with you, respect you and treat you accordingly AND your dirty little ego will get a massive boost by being the big fish in a little pond, having hubbys drooling over the sight of YOU nailing supercute German/Czech/Hungarian girls into oblivion...

      And after 5 or 6 hours of multiple fun you can just leave as a satisfied, free man. If you feel the inclination for something of this blatantly selfish nature, I advise you to check it out. And comes at a negligible financial investment... i. e. much cheaper andmuch more hassle-free than many real-life encounters. The only caveat is: you gotta have your shit together, otherwise you're gonna be one of those poor, miserable German hubbys... *LOL*

  10. I feel sorry for people like that.

    Being 5f2, that must be really difficult.

  11. Best comment right here
    "Our understanding of the game might change in a few years and new advanced courses and concepts may evolve which can finally bring salvation to you."
    Yes, an advanced course will bring you salvation.

    1. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

  12. Sleazy, this is one of THE core truths of human existence itself! Kudos & chapeau! to you for phrasing it so unmistakeably succintly:

    "Sadly this is a trap many men and women fall into. No, your romantic partners are not there to give your life meaning. If you're a miserable piece of shit without having someone to fuck, you're most likely remain a miserable piece of shit even if you manage to get a girlfriend."

  13. Aaron I don't agree with this at all, you're a smart guy so how could you miss the human condition aspect of what's happening here.?

    "Sadly this is a trap many men and women fall into. No, your romantic partners are not there to give your life meaning. If you're a miserable piece of shit without having someone to fuck, you're most likely remain a miserable piece of shit even if you manage to get a girlfriend."

    I feel similar to this guy. My life is worth living of course, and I'm not miserable person.We all want to be with someone, we all yearn for that "touch". And the more I see my friends and other people around me having relationships the more isolated, weird, sad, and "miserable" I become.
    I can go to the movies by myself and enjoy it, I even travel by myself and have fun - but I'm sure if I had a girlfriend it would be better. On an intellectual tangent isn't being with someone THE meaning of life biologically anyway since millions of years of evolution have designed us to reproduce and continue the species.

    1. You're trying to play a linguistic game here. The general statement is that your happiness will not improve just because you have a girlfriend. Call your basic happiness level 'X'. You expect that with a girlfriend you happiness level, no matter what it is, would improve. This is decidedly not the case.

      Just like the guy this post is about, you fantasize that things "would be better" if you had a girlfriend. Sorry, but on what planet do you live on? Even when I was single, and a virgin, I never had the belief that my life would improve if I had some chick to bang. This was based on having friends who were in relationships. While a lot of people simply put on an act in public, I knew from my closer friends that women can be quite a pain in the ass. In fact, I was acquainted with some guys who had a girlfriend (and who would have been much happier on their own) because they claimed it was expected of them. I grew up in a very conservative environment, so your life circumstances may be a lot different. Still, if you think that relationships, of whatever duration and intensity, are all sunshine and roses, you're in for a rude awakening.

    2. I've been in relationships before - some crappy, some good. Not to get bogged down with words - but i think you missed my entire point. I'D LIKE IT if I were with someone (female) to do things with wheter they be of a romantic nature, or just regular. Going to a comdey club is fun by yourself, but you laugh more when your're with friends - it's a proven fact. As for my happiness being "X"
      -Really??? Happiness is too complicated to be part of a math equation and at the same time fluxiates and hinges on certain things. We all want to someone to share our lives with, whether they enrich it or not is usually a gamble. Joe schmoe with average looks, intelligence, money, and happiness level still wants to be with someone. Even people who are very successful can feel unhappy without someone, feeling that they "failed" in their love life.It depends
      on your value system and how much significance you place on relationships.

      I always have an open mind though. So how should I feel when I keep going to parties/gatherings and my friends all have partners, and then they ask where is mine? or When are you going to get a girlfriend? I dont feel pressured, but I do want the same. Or should I say "relationships are the pits and I swear off women and sex forever?"

    3. Do you have male friends?

      Further, read up on the 'hedonic treadmill':

      Calling something 'x' is not math, but merely an abstraction to indicate your basic level of happiness. You seem unhappy at your baseline happiness level, and you expect that level to rise. It doesn't matter whether your baseline happiness level is one of misery or one of genuine happiness --- it will not rise if you get a girlfriend, or win the lottery, or get a salary raise. Besides, some of the most miserable people I know are in relationships, so even though your happiness level may not increase, it could very well decrease by getting into a relationship.

    4. I might be severely misjudging here, but this guy's attitude somewhat reminds me of people who are comparatively well off, but do lack a deeper interest or passion in their life. And no: "playing computer games", "going to the movies", "shopping", "pick up" or "meeting friends" unfortunately don't count as "passion" in this regard.

    5. Yeah I have guy friends. I consider them pussies though.
      Ironically they all have girlfriends and didn't use any PUA stuff, don't dress well, nor know much about women or relationships, and look average (grant it -the girls are 5 - 6's on the normal girl scale, you'd probably consider them lower with the girls you've been with I'm sure) It seems that they were just "there" the girl liked them and BOOM - cup of noodles GF. I can say the ease of them finding someone without doing much of anything externally or internally has made me a tad resentful, but I take solace in knowing I've been with better looking girls and will continue to do so hopefully.

      @ Aaron, I know all about the treadmill and I believe it's true. I pose this to you. If you're a happy person but you have a ton of bills, you're stressed out about losing your home and your kids going to school, you become bitter with despair. You still treat people well and have a good disposition, but the underlying problem is money and the stress is trickling over causing negativity. If you win the Lottery, the source of your stress is gone - and you can continue being a pleasurable person with that problem tucked away. I get what you're saying though & i believe you understand what I'm saying too. That's so true about miserable people in relationships

      I read your book "Minimal Game" and while It didnt' telll me much I didn't already know, it did solidify my philosophies and refine them. So chatting with you now really is an "Ahhh (lotus position)" moment.

      @Marco - I do have passions & distractions - Hmm, I just have always been a person with the mindset "If you want something, you must put your energy into achieving it". If I tunnel vision on my passions, I'm not sure women will enter my life in a romantic way. So I'm tunnel visioning on women and relationships until I'm satisfied with the result and then continue doing what I love. Is this mindset wrong?

    6. Seeing how you describe your male friends, I assume they also were "just there" when you met them. Otherwise you wouldn't disparage them. I bet they put as little thought into their looks as into everything else they do. Yet, somehow you think you'd find some super-interesting girl who would share your interests.

      About the treadmill: you're speaking of a purely theoretical position. One of the most eye opening experiences I've had was hanging out with guys from different social strata in London. My impression was that those who think they have to keep up appearances, i.e. spend more than they can actually afford, worry the most about money. However, those who are used to struggling are relatively unfazed by financial pressure because they have the belief that there is some way out. (By the way, people who are prone to worrying will always find something new to worry about.) Further, they are much more about maximizing their life satisfaction right now, as opposed to do the middle class thing of planning for their retirement where they will catch up on everything they missed out on (fat chance!).

      Lastly, do you actively approach women or merely obsess over them? It strikes me that you're doing the latter. Your underlying problem does indeed seem to be that you've got no genuine interests in life. If you were genuinely passionate about something --- and not in the bullshit HR kind of way --- you would pursue it no matter what.

    7. Couldn't have said it better.

    8. Yeah I have guy friends. I consider them pussies though.

      As so succinctly stated elsewhere (or possibly just by me), "You are the company you keep."

      Then again, that is a tough road to hoe (vicious circle, you know...), since no woman wants to carry that kind of excess baggage around, either.

      Anyway, I can see some of your struggle since I'm the only one of myself and my siblings that isn't married and I don't date much. I'm fine with that. I have standards and I believe I bring good qualities to the table. Way back in my early 20s, I dated "just to date" because "everyone else did it, too". Well, that didn't work out to anything but lots of free meals for chicks who are fat now and looking at the Facebooks of those women, I did okay learning to cut my losses.

    9. You're sweeping generalizations on everything seems to me that you think you know everything about everything. Most know it alls are always black & white so i'm not surprised. I didn't come here for a pity party, to be coddled, nor did I come here not ready to face some hard truths. I've known most of my friends for years and they never talk to girls or put themselves out there. They are not brave people regardless of women, so I call them pussies. And yes you can assume all you want - doesn't make it even remotely accurate.I can talk about my friends anyway I please, doesn't make anything i say or do less valid if it's true, nor does it define me. Yes I actively approach women, not cold approaches. I can say I obsess about getting better with women, and my social skills. So if someone isn't following their passion all the way through - they really don't care about it? Sounds like the"nuh unh" defense to me.They're are some people who quit there job or move- just to be in a better dating pool. I think you're just trying to salvage your original argument of calling someone "pathetic" if you think having someone in your life will make things better - which is purely subjective in the first place. And who is the final judge on the quality of one's life - you?

      I just came here to learn and share - not be verbally eviscerated with the underlying messages of "If you think a relationship will make you happy ur wrong" / Relationships are the pits / You should have passions to occupy your life, and that should be your focus, not getting laid". You've fought too many battles against feminist and PUAtards, and you've read too much Nietzsche.
      Every responce sounds like entropic drivel. What is HR Bullshit?

    10. Did you take some oestrogen pills today by any chance?

      Yes, what you say does reveal a lot about you, even if you're not ready to face the truth. Sorry, but you do indeed sound like someone with an enormous sense of entitlement and a distinct lack of personality. Your lack of initiative is evident as well --- why don't you just google 'HR' if you don't know the term? You are passive and complacent, just like your friends. You obsess about women, but you have no real interests, by your own admission. Don't worry, though, at least you won't offend many people in life for being different.

    11. So I win? Awesome !

  14. @MP: Agreed!

    "So, the next time you feel lonely, just devote yourself to your interests, and you'll notice that those feelings will quickly dissipate."

    Taken from

    On a side note: I would count playing -certain- computer games as a genuine passion. Like minecraft, which can be used as kind of an enegenrig/construction software. Just have a look at this:

  15. May I say that I equalky take as much pleasure in reading the articles, as well as the comments on tbis blog (and even if I'm not actively participating).
    There is much life wisdom to be learned and realized from those exchanges.
    so thanks again to you "Aaron" and to everyone else as well.

    1. You're welcome. Once a guy sent me a mail that contained something like "I originally came for the lulz, but I stayed for the conversation". Sure, I make fun of people sometimes, but it's in a constructive way.

    2. That which does not kill us makes us stronger.



    Hey Aaron, Rosh recently did an interview with a feminist. Would appreciate your thoughts and comments on it. Maybe you should do a blog post on it.


Note: Only a member of this blog may post a comment.