Thursday, July 3, 2014

Scared because you’re pushing 30?

Earlier today someone left a comment on my forum, saying that due to some personal problems he hasn’t gotten laid in years, and now that is 30 already, he is afraid that he has missed the boat. To corroborate his statement, he remarked that he had 22-year old girls in clubs tell him that he was too old. I’d like to discuss this issue in more general terms, since I’ve heard countless variations of that theme.

It is certainly the case that age will affect your chances on the dating market. However, guys in their late 20s or early 30s are a good decade away from needing to worry whether they can still score chicks. But let’s dwell on that girl’s remark, and why it’s nonsense. First, it is a single opinion that may not even be grounded in reality. For instance, maybe that girl was into him, but he was awkward, so she chose to attack him instead. This is fairly common behaviour.

Further, think about all the things any girl could ever want in a guy: it’s basically anything. Even worse, a lot of girls are so conflicted that they don’t even know what exactly it is that they want. He is supposed to have money and be successful in his job, but he is also supposed to have a lot of spare time that is to be spent exclusively with her. Or maybe he is supposed to be strong and masculine, but of course he also has to have a weak side and should cry. Those two contradictions are quite possibly the ones you most often hear about. But, hey, why bother with rationality at all?

Guys normally don’t have the comfort of being able to make up justifications for their fickle behaviour as they go along, but instead they have to show some consistency. You would get rather negative feedback if you loudly pronounced that something you desperately wanted you no longer found interesting now that you got it. Girls commonly exhibit that kind of behaviour, though, and white knights fall over themselves to make excuses for some upset little princess.

The purpose of this detour was to highlight that you’re better off ignoring what some random girl says. Should the next guy who is into her, and whom she likes, be a bit older, her rationalisation hamster will work overtime to give her a reason why she likes him. A large difference in age will of course justify her attraction because he is so ‘mature’.

You will normally only meet girls in some kind of social context — at this point it’s fairly well-established that ‘cold approaching’ women on the street is a colossal waste of time —, which means that as long as you have access to situations and venues where there are enough young girls around, you’ll get plenty of chances. Obviously, as a graduate student in your late 20s living on campus you’ll have a much easier time meeting girls who are barely out of their teens than if you live in BFE.

I frequently stress the importance of one's environment. While you had little choice over your environment as you grew up, as an adult you can move somewhere else if your current environment is holding you back. Moving, and starting a new chapter in your life, may be quite scary. The benefits can be enormous. Big cities tend to offer better employment opportunities, and plenty of opportunity for socializing. It’s hardly the most important thing in life, but, yes, it’s also a lot easier to get laid in a bigger city. You certainly wouldn't have to lose sleep because you've turned 30.


  1. Wow you know that guy who claims that being 30 is a deal breaker for a man is not living in reality. There are plenty of young women in their early to mid 20s looking for older men. However most older men need to be attractive and masculine to pull it off. As you and I already know too well many men and women in western society don't take care of themselves and become more unattractive as time goes on. I literally just pulled up three random profiles up on and they were all women under 25 who are open to dating men over 30. And they were also attractive women so this guy is doing something very wrong and that is wrong thinking on his own part.

  2. Dear Aaron,
    Great that you’re back with this blog!
    I always very much benefitted from your stuff. It's a shame I did not stumble upon it much earlier in my life :(

    I have some questions/remarks concerning this post:

    Could you please elaborate on this part of your article some further?

    „For instance, maybe that girl was into him, but he was awkward, so she chose to attack him instead. This is fairly common behavior.“

    Why exactly start women attacking the guy in this scenario? Are they mad at themselves for having been interested in what turned out to be an awkward “creep”?
    Or do they presume that he’s disinterested and arrogant, if he does not properly react to them showing their interest?
    How exactly would those attacks look like. Would they be just sassy or really vile?

    Could you please elaborate on the topic of “mixed signals”, which Alek Novy often mentions? I think it might be to some degree connected to the upper point.

    3) Quite off topic, but I think and hope still coherent with the overall topic of your blog:
    Could you please make a little post about Max Pütz, the german PUA fraud who somewhat weaseled his way into the german men’s right movement?

    He is quite represent for a quite new generation of PUAs, who seem to be even somewhat anti pua at the first glance but really are full of overcomplicating shit and at the end of the day harm men way more than the help them.

    The only clown I ever fell for I have to admit ☹

    Now that’s a mouthful, I know, but I just took the freedom to get these thoughts and questions of mine out here and of course I don’t demand that you reply to them, (since I’m not a sociopath ;)
    But of course I would be glad to read your thoughts on them.

    Keep up the brilliant work of yours! I’m looking forward to your future posts.


    1. Hi Brent,

      contrary to the image portrayed by mainstream media, it is not the case that the typical woman is particularly mature or shows much decency. Say, some chick fancies some guy. Guy notices this and walks over to her, but because he is rather awkward, this turns her off. Lacking decency, she then decides to ridicule him. There is another aspect: if she makes fun of him, she will maintain her self-image: it's much easier for her to construct a narrative according to which he never was attractive to he (even though he initially was), and act like a bitch towards him.

      Verbal aggression is most common, although, if you go out often enough, you'll also see women who physically attack guys and, for instance, push them away. This looks quite humorous when a slim girl does it, due to lack of physical strength.

      Regarding mixed signals, I'm sure you'll find a lot of material on the forum. Minimal Game also has something on that.

      Maximilian Puetz is the kind of character I'm not at all interested spending mental energy on.

    2. Hi Aaron,

      thanks for your detailed answer!

      So much for “girls are made of all things nice” :P

      „Maximilian Puetz is the kind of character I'm not at all interested spending mental energy on.“

      And so should I be. “Don’t cry over split milk.” Moving on.

      I will definitely check out your forum, once I find the time. I’m sure it’s more than worthwhile.



  3. Thank you Aaron for posting this. Its something that I needed to read, especially because I'm close to 30 myself. I found your site while googling something about Roosh and as I started reading your site, more and more of the content and the things you had to say resonated with me. This is the most sane approach to women I've found. I'll be picking up Minimal Game soon and look forward to improving myself, rather than relying on vaguely defined or ill-thought "techniques" that are more exercises in frustration.

    1. Thanks for the support, Will! Please let me know how you like Minimal Game.

  4. Great post. I'd just add one "caveat" or "yes but" clarifier if I may.

    Yes if you're 30, you shouldn't be panicking just because you are 30. And yes you have a good decade of fucking around before your age becomes an issue.


    That assumes you have your sh*t handled. If you're an asocial 29 year old who's still largely afraid to meet new people, you probably should be panicking. If you only meet 1-2 women a month, and largely have "flirting anxiety", have low social skills or are still scared make a move etc... You should be panicking.

    Because if you've lived your entire 20s being a hermit with low social skills, no ability to read cues and don't know/can't make a move... it might take a while before you get comfortable with it.

    You should be panicking in the sense that you don't know how long it will take you to develop the confidence and social skills to actually meet these women.

    So you better get started right now, get minimal game, study some of the forum, and start going out right now, go out more than you're used to until you get comfortable with meeting people and socializing, and making moves on women.

    Then you can dial it back down and cruise through the rest of your 30s, meeting a couple of women a week, and knowing when to make a move should keep you quite sexually busy for the rest of your thirties.

    Just my opinion.

    1. Thank you very much for making this important point, Alek!
      I'm in my late 20s now and although I don't consider myself a socially inept person, I'm quite a hermit and still a virgin (never even kissed a girl since kindergarten).

      I'ver read Minimal Game 9 month ago and skimmed through it on a regular basis then.
      I have the lust to "just go for it" but I just lack the time and energy (busy with my master thesis), the mobility (no car, not even a driving license) and the logistics (still live with my parents far away from the hot spots of the nearby city.)
      No social hobbies, not a bi social circle, mostly couples, hardly someone new introduced.

      On the other hand, I'm quite happy with my life and I don't want to extract resources (mainly time and energy) from my master thesis to get involved with "bitches" ;)
      I need to focus to graduate.

      It's kind of like a catch twenty two, since i fear that inexperienced like I am now, I might just get abused by nasty women. Although I am now aware of the often toxic female nature, I still might fall pray to it the moment my hormones take control over my brain (the power of denial you know). On the other hand I know, that I should get practiced and start building up a love life.

      I only wish I was a bit more mobile(and was making some money, so I could see escorts at least 3-4 times a year =P)
      I'm planing to make my driving license next year, get a car and move out when I finished my phd the latest.

      That does it for todays moaning ;)


    2. I have bad news for you... In a few years you will regret this way of thinking and say "man, if I had only found 180 minutes a week to go out, I'd be so much further, instead of here I am at 35 having to start from zero, why was I so... dense... erggggggggh"

      I am not telling you "go out and get laid". I am saying "get the basic skills in *case* you change your mind". This is probably the last time when you can decide to go and get this handled... especially since you're a busy person and it will take a long time.

      ... You can not get abused for practicing flirting skills and making moves. Trust me, as a virgin you're quite a few levels detached from getting anywhere near "i'll get abused by a woman"

      ** Here's what I would recommend, not taking this advice will probably result in decades of regret.

      Do it for the "closure". Don't go out to "get women" or "get laid"... Do it "just in case I need the basic skill later in life". Trust me, you don't want to be a 40 year old who still doesn't know how to initiate a flirty conversation or make a move and you're making your first attempts at 40 - it will be 1000x more creepy then.

      You don't have to get involved with any women. Just go out to practice the basics, starting conversations and making moves... If you don't want to get involved with any women, just go up to the point of making out. You can find 3 hours a week to be social, and no "mobility" is not an issue.

      Again, you don't have to get involved with any women, in fact if you want only see it as "I am just practicing so I have this as backup plan in case I need the ability in the future". At least get to the point where you can comfortably get social conversations with a couple of new women a week, and at least try to get up to perhaps kissing 1-2 women a month.

      When you achieve that, then you know you have the absolute minimum confidence and (dating-related) social skills, so you can relax and go back to being a hermit, knowing you have a "backup".

      Don't burn your bridges, don't be without a backup...

    3. Alek, I can't thank you enough for this comment, I really can not! It' s almost life saving!

      The last thing I want is to spend the following decades of my life in pain and regret and misery.

      I'll have to spend the next couple of days in the lab, but I will get my ass moving within the following week and work towards the reasonable goals you suggested me to focus on.

      I always liked you comments best on this blog, although I am a huge sleazy "fanboy". But I think you do a better job in stuping things down for the clueless beginners like me.

      To make it clear: I am not saying, that sleazy does a bad job and is not able to break things down for beginners- this could not be further from the truth and I can only advise every straight male weather virgin or player to get a copy of minimal game-, I am just saying that you -in my humble opinion- are better in stuping things down for the clueless. Your comments often made the difference for me.

      Anyhow: Thank you so much, Alek! Thank you so FUCKING much!


  5. I appreciate that this is a lot more realistic than the manosphere thinking you automatically become George Clooney when you hit 40.

  6. I'm 32 now and the last 6 girls I've been with 21, 22, 23, 26, 27, 29. Thing is I look younger than I really am. Usually I get 24-26. But in situations where I would tell my age to a much younger girl they never seem to care much. However I have wings I go out with who are the same age or even younger than I am but look like they are older and they do get that "you are too old to be here" response once in a while. But then again there are plenty of 25-30 year old women that are beautiful and sexy so why even bother worrying. Aaron is right saying that you have a good decade before getting even remotely concerned about it.

  7. This is such a great article. I'm 29 and as weird as it sounds, it seems like I've gotten "better with age". Again, I keep myself in shape, dress well, have social skills and a good job. I really blossomed more with women around 25.

    The oldest woman I've hooked up with this year was 25. I find myself to be most attractive to women in the age range of 22-25 right now for some reason. I'm getting close to settling down but not 100% there yet. The way I see it, even if I were to get more serious with a woman around 31 or 32, I could still easily pull a hottie between the ages of 23ish/24ish to 30. It's amazing what a clean diet, regular exercise and good sleep will do to make you look much younger than you are.


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